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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 12:34 am 
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clcorbin wrote:
megasquirt succeeded because they started VERY simple (perhaps too simple, but hey, it DID succeed!).

Speaking about Megasquirt and success, I am really wondering what would it take to crack their monopoly. There is so many of them it's like Megasquirt is now the synonym of 'diy ems'.
Price? Features? GDI/CDI? Is it even possible to get anything on this market?

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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:21 am 
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russian wrote:
Speaking about Megasquirt and success, I am really wondering what would it take to crack their monopoly. There is so many of them it's like Megasquirt is now the synonym of 'diy ems'.
Price? Features? GDI/CDI? Is it even possible to get anything on this market?


The products aren't very good and sell mainly on price . Offer an alternative with a lower price and you will take their customers. The people that tend to turn up on forums like this are generally looking for a cheaper alternative to MS so the demand is there.

That leads to this though. The MS installs I've seen can best be described as a "hot mess". They put low cost above all else and it shows in both the install itself and the final performance. Not to say there aren't some decent MS installs out there, I've just never seen one but I have helped remove a couple not so nice MS installs.

At the other end of the spectrum where bosch, motec, etc live the standard is perfection which is a much much harder market to break into...but I don't think I've ever even heard about some one who's used one of these higher end products willingly giving it up....they are really really nice.

Then the re-flash market is busy consuming the vast majority of customers. Its been over 30 years since a car was sold without EFI and modern cars have basically every system on the vehicle tied into the ECU making it very very difficult to do a decent aftermarket install, but a re-flash not only lets you keep all the cool OEM features its also the cheapest and most reliable....pretty hard to beat so this is where the lion's share of the customers live.

That leaves mostly people working on old cars with no budget of any kind (MS customers) and people working on higher-end stuff (bosch, motec, etc customers) with no budget (limits) of any kind...and about 6 of us who want to build an ecu to say we built an ecu :)


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 11:54 am 
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mk e wrote:
...and about 6 of us who want to build an ecu to say we built an ecu :)


LOL!


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 11:30 pm 
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make that 7 :)


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 7:53 am 
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And 8 :p

My main limiter is requiring a $5000 compiler to touch any of the really cool stuff (and support my decoder requirements), but I'm still keeping an eye on things!


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 7:56 am 
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9 + but with a quirk.

Because of our unique fuelling needs we will be producing a modular hardware platform, we've also just started from scratch with the firmware from AN4907/8, took about two hours to port to the TRK board.

As such there are some revolutionary ideas floating around the office here and there may be a flow on opportunity that could inject some new life into o5e?

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Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 9:06 am 
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screenshot of running system as of this evening


Attachments:
File comment: Freemaster view of eTPU MPC5634M
FreeMaster Franken8.JPG
FreeMaster Franken8.JPG [ 155.66 KiB | Viewed 14126 times ]

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Bosch K-Jetronic Injection with FrankenCIS
Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS
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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:50 pm 
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reanimotion wrote:
9 + but with a quirk.

Because of our unique fuelling needs we will be producing a modular hardware platform, we've also just started from scratch with the firmware from AN4907/8, took about two hours to port to the TRK board.

As such there are some revolutionary ideas floating around the office here and there may be a flow on opportunity that could inject some new life into o5e?


When did AN4907/8 release....nice update form what we've been using it appears.


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:51 pm 
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reanimotion wrote:
screenshot of running system as of this evening


Ok....what are we looking at exactly?


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:55 pm 
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released august 2014 and yes - appears to resolve most if not all of your issues with eTPU

I found a reference to AN4907 and just happened to do a search of the Freescale site on 4908 to see what was next, and found this little nugget.

The screenshot is a configurable/programmable tuning/flash/scope tool that just happens to be sending data to the tooth generator and monitoring the output of all the eTPU channels while the ported 5674F demo runs on the TRK.

Oh and serial/can protocol libraries for most Freescale auto/industrial MCUs

If you have it in you to reboot, then I'd start with this, if not then I'd like to take it on after (or even while) we get ours out there.

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Bosch K-Jetronic Injection with FrankenCIS
Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 9:08 pm 
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And to confuse everybody further....

Our plan is - produce two levels of hardware,
NanoSkwert(tm) - 2 fuel 1 ignition, minimal sensors in a Deutsch housing for FrankenCIS and bikes etc. (in prototype/design now)

GigaSkwert(tm) - modular extendable CAN based networked series of task specific boxes - like Lego for EMS and body control. (in planning)

Both based on the MPC processors, with common firmware and documented ecosystem to allow multiple suppliers and the hobby/DIY to all play

Centrally controlled by us like Linux, but outside of the core ecosystem do anything you like.

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Bosch K-Jetronic Injection with FrankenCIS
Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 4:51 pm 
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You'd really pique my interest if you did the Nano with two independent ignitions, since there are twins (like mine) that are not even-fire. Would also give the option to support 4-cylinder engines in a banked / batch / wasted spark configuration.

Also, if you haven't already, look at the MC33814 chip. It can drive outputs via SPI or logic level toggles, provide limited diagnostics, protection for drivers, O2 heater control, et cetera, and requires a handful of external support components.


reanimotion wrote:
And to confuse everybody further....

Our plan is - produce two levels of hardware,
NanoSkwert(tm) - 2 fuel 1 ignition, minimal sensors in a Deutsch housing for FrankenCIS and bikes etc. (in prototype/design now)

GigaSkwert(tm) - modular extendable CAN based networked series of task specific boxes - like Lego for EMS and body control. (in planning)

Both based on the MPC processors, with common firmware and documented ecosystem to allow multiple suppliers and the hobby/DIY to all play

Centrally controlled by us like Linux, but outside of the core ecosystem do anything you like.

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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:56 am 
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abecedarian wrote:
You'd really pique my interest if you did the Nano with two independent ignitions...look at the MC33814 chip.


I was looking at the MC33905 for CAN and LIN to multi purpose the module and keep it below $200, as that ties in with our CAN gateway needs on a GPS/3g/BT telematics product for other projects.

We've ordered a few of samples of the 814 to eval - if the VR circuit is any good it might be a go :)

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Bosch K-Jetronic Injection with FrankenCIS
Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS


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 Post subject: Re: Where and When do we Restart?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:31 pm 
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russian wrote:
Price? Features? GDI/CDI?


For anyone to succeed, I think you need to look first at the German MS community and KDFI. Apparently due to TUV and inspections, a high quality but simple system that can either be installed stealth in a factory housing or looks factory anyway is the requirement in Europe.
Second, the original "Tuner" market in Japan. High labour costs and good incomes meant a direct plug in or bolt on that could be installed in minutes was the only economical option.

We have in the EMS arena
1 - high quality and expensive closed systems usually pro-installed
2 - mid level 'Crate Motor" plug and play closed systems
3 - low quality inexpensive DIY semi open MS - usually poorly installed.
4 - and then the Tinker market where extreme DIY is the norm and generally accompanied by "I had to hand make each of these because.." and every implementation can be considered an unfinished stand-alone invention.

Right now, I happily stick my hand up and say "I'm a card carrying member of #4" But, commercially we are in 1 & 2.

Having said all that, the opportunity lies in not competing with MS at all, but to run past and go modern!

GDI/CDI - proper CAN, LIN, the newish SENT/SPC sensor protocol, It's already there in the hardware and Freescale support it all with Libraries and App Notes, so - simple 4 cyl batch/wasted hardware - simple core firmware - TunerStudio or similar and a damn good firmware loader, all bring Joe Average in and give you some scale.
List the toys and promote eTPU and a good dev infrastructure CW10 and OSBDM and let the people come and play, thus building the rest of the options over time.

So 3 & 4 are probably where the wriggle room is. If you could cater for 4 in Open firmware but produce hardware and firmware for a hybrid of 2&3 using current tech you would have a very good chance.
But... the real trick would be to not directly compete with 2&3 by doing something better! And that's where the 5xxx and the rest of the Freescale gear comes in.

BTW, for heavens sake - Promote the Freescale eTPU hardware and libraries as your point of difference. It really is the prime selling point!
"OEM level hardware and firmware" should be across the top of every page here

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Bosch K-Jetronic Injection with FrankenCIS
Yes! mechanical/hydraulic constant flow injection can be managed by a modern EMS


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